The following is the transcript of an interview with Rep. Jim Himes, Democrat of Connecticut, that aired on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan” on May 25, 2025.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We’re joined now by Congressman Jim Himes. He is the top Democrat on the Intelligence Committee, and he joins us today from Greenwich, Connecticut. Good morning to you.
REP. JIM HIMES: Good morning, Margaret. Thanks for having me.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You just heard the speaker. I know you did not vote for this bill. But you know, Connecticut has one of the highest state and local tax burdens in the country. Do you at least like that one little portion of this bill?
REP. HIMES: That one little portion is going to be good for my constituents, but Margaret, I- I got to tell you, it was like listening to “1984” or something, listening to the speaker. You know, anybody can look this up, the American people want basically three things out of their federal budget. Number one, at this point in time when Americans, the wealthiest Americans, are doing better than ever before, Americans want the wealthiest of the Amer- of Americans to pay more taxes, and to give tax relief to the middle class and below. Number two, they want us to address the deficit, which is now spiraling out of control to the point where we got a downgrade in one of the U.S. credit ratings. And third, they want a simpler tax code. This bill spe- fails spectacularly on all three counts. They’re cutting Medicaid and nutritional assistance, food stamps, to tens of millions of Americans in order to preserve tax breaks for the wealthiest Americans. They’re adding $3 trillion to the deficit with this bill. And lastly, they’re gumming up the tax code with, you don’t have to pay taxes on tips. Now, what about the folks who don’t earn tips? You know, auto lending. I mean, again, on the three things that Americans care most about, that they want the Congress to do, this bill fails spectacularly. Look, and that’s going to show up in the polling pretty soon, as Americans come to realize what it is that the House of Representatives just did .
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, I want to ask you about your other role on the House Intelligence Committee. When it comes to what the President has vowed to do to Russia, he floated this idea two weeks ago of possible sanctions if Russia doesn’t stop its war in Ukraine. But then he spoke to Vladimir Putin on Monday, and we heard nothing about sanctions. We did hear from the head of the Defense Intelligence Agency that this war is trending in favor of Russia. What changes need to be made, if anything, to how the U.S. provides support?
REP. HIMES: Well, Margaret, look, we’re at a fork in the road with respect to the Russia-Ukraine war. And you know, Donald Trump and his acolytes in the Congress will go along with one of these two choices: either we will continue the trajectory that started when the president and the vice president humiliated Vladimir- humiliated President Zelenskyy in the Oval Office and paused aid, and Vladimir Putin will learn from that experience that he can count on the U.S. to support his murderous incursions into neighboring countries. Or we can take another path, which I hope the president will take, which is to say, what we need to do right now is generate maximum leverage against Vladimir Putin, and I see the president getting a little frustrated by him, but that maximum leverage comes because we really uptick the sanctions. We stop the export of oil. We pressure India to stop buying Russian oil, and of course, we keep arming the Ukrainians. Again, for this guy who considers himself the master of the deal, maximize the leverage of the West so that we can bring this war not just to a conclusion, but to a fair and just conclusion that will keep the Russians from invading countries in the future.
MARGARET BRENNAN: In your role on the Intelligence Committee, you get to see things the public does not. With that in mind, the President has designated this Venezuelan gang, Tren de Ar- Aragua, TDA, as a foreign terrorist organization. He says they’re invading the country. He’s using the Alien Enemies Act to deport alleged members without a day in court. Part of the legal justification of all of this rests on the claim that the Venezuelan government is controlling what TDA is doing. The National Intelligence Council assessed the Maduro government does not control the gang. But, on this program last Sunday, the secretary of state rejected that. He says he favors the FBI’s finding, which is that some members of the Venezuelan government do influence the gang. Why does all of this matter?
REP. HIMES: Well, it matters Margaret, because I’ll remind you that in the George W. Bush administration, exactly what is happening right now happened. It was a different topic. Right now, despite the conclusions of the intelligence community, the president, the Director of National Intelligence and the secretary of state are saying that Venezuela directs Tren De Aragua. Now they’re saying that because they need this no due process mechanism of deporting people, the Alien Enemies Act, which, by the way, the courts are now laughing at. But the reason it matters, Margaret, is because the last time the White House did this, when they were determined that the intelligence community be forced to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, which there turned out not to be, 4,400 American servicemen perished in a war that was fought on false pretenses, not to mention, by the way, the many hundreds of thousands of Iraqis who perished in that war, which was a catastrophic strategic mistake driven by the politicization, the- the notion that George W. Bush had that there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. That’s why intelligence matters. There’s 4,400 families in this country who lost people because the White House decided they would override the conclusion of their $90 billion a year intelligence community. That’s what Marco Rubio is doing. That’s what the president is doing, and that’s what Director Gabbard are doing when they contradict what their own organization is telling them.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So on that point, this is also becoming an issue for Joe Kent, who is the president’s nominee to run the National Counterterrorism Center. He’s under scrutiny because emails show that while acting as chief of staff to DNI Gabbard, he pressed analysts to amend an assessment of links between the government and TDA. According to redacted emails that my network has obtained, he wrote, “we need to do some rewriting, a little more analysis so this document is not used against the DNI or POTUS,” the president of the United States. He says, “we need to…incorporate the FBI’s assessment.” You have now read these declassified emails as well. Do you believe that Joe Kent was just asking for more context?
REP. HIMES: No, he absolutely was not. And I have seen the redacted emails. He was pressuring the National Intelligence Council to alter their conclusions. And look, he gave away the game. You just read the line. He told us why he did that, so that this report would not be used against the president or the Director of National Intelligence. Think about that. The chief of staff of the- of the Office of the Director National Intelligence wasn’t saying, we need the very best intelligence here. We need you to go back and make sure you’re 100% true. He was saying, we need to make sure that your product is not used to embarrass the president and the Director of National Intelligence. That is the very definition, the very definition, of politicizing intelligence. This is not about embarrassing or not embarrassing anybody. Again, back to those 4,400 dead Americans. So no, Joe Kent must never be confirmed for any Senate confirmed- look, it’s all out there for the Senate to see. So no, he may- he must never be confirmed for any Senate confirmed position because of what he did.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Okay. And those emails are available for the public to read as well. Congressman Himes, thank you for your time today. We’ll be right back with a lot more “Face the Nation.”
