The following is the transcript of an interview with Rep. Michael McCaul, Republican of Texas, that aired on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan” on May 11, 2025.
ED O’KEEFE: Now we turn to Texas Republican Congressman Michael McCaul, who joins us from Austin. He is a senior member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee and the House Homeland Security Committee. Congressman, thank you for being with us. I wanted to start first with the situation in Ukraine, because over the weekend, the U.S., Europe and Ukraine, put forward a proposal now for a 30-day cease-fire that would start on Monday. President Putin has essentially flouted it and is calling for direct talks again with Ukraine to be held in Turkey at some point, without conditions. How close are we, do you think, to a breakthrough?
REP. MICHAEL MCCAUL: If I could first, Ed, say Happy Mother’s Day to all the mothers, especially my wife, Linda. Now getting on to the subject at hand. It’s- it’s very intense. You know, there was a 30-day cease-fire called for. Mr. Putin decided to bomb Ukraine on Palm Sunday. He’s not making any concessions at all, while Zelenskyy seems to be making all the concessions. So if- the bottom line is Putin has to agree to a 30-day cease-fire for any peace talks to go forward, and the land that he is asking for is- you know, even JD Vance talked about this, and the president, you know, land that- that Russia has not even occupied in Ukraine, so he has to operate in good faith. We want peace, but not peace at any price, because peace at any price is like appeasement, like we saw with Chamberlain and Hitler, and that’s unacceptable.
ED O’KEEFE: Now, the president has suggested in the past week that the U.S. might impose additional sanctions on Russia if they don’t agree to this cease-fire. You know that South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham has at least 70 of his colleagues in the Senate on board with a new sanctions bill. You’re on the House version of it as well. How likely is that legislation to get to the floor?
REP. MCCAUL: That’s really up to Mr. Putin. I mean, whether there are sanctions or another supplemental bill to fund this conflict, we’d like to see this thing over with the Pope, who I’m so proud of being a Catholic and an American Pope, called for peace, but not at any price. And so if Mr. Putin does not agree to a 30-day ceasefire, I think the sanctions are almost certain, not only from the Congress, but from the White House.
ED O’KEEFE: Well, okay, that’s one way to call out Russia. The other- I suppose we need to put pressure on Russia by continuing to arm Ukraine. You were instrumental in getting that last round of military aid for Ukraine passed, but Speaker Johnson has said there’s no plan to bring a new round of military aid to the House floor. What do you need to do now to convince the Speaker to hold a vote on that legislation?
REP. MCCAUL: Well, getting it passed the last time was a major accomplishment. Had we not accomplished that, Ed, Russia would be occupying Ukraine today. No question in my mind. There is presidential drawdown authorities for more weapons to go into Ukraine if Mr. Putin decides to not negotiate in good faith. So again, it’s really, up to Mr. Putin who so far has not been negotiating in good faith, as to how we proceed from here. And we all want this war to end. We all want peace, but we want a just peace.
ED O’KEEFE: The President, as we mentioned, is headed to the Middle East tomorrow, on Monday, there are reports he’s no longer demanding Saudi recognition of Israel as a condition for a nuclear deal with the United States. Is that a mistake, or is this nuclear agreement so critical that not acknowledging Ukraine, letting that go is okay?
REP. MCCAUL: We don’t have all the details. I know he’s there to discuss an economic alliance with the Saudis, with the UAE- UAE, with the Arab nations. And that’s important, just like the minerals deal that the Ukraine parliament voted for. The more economically we’re tied to the Middle East, the more we’re security tied, and that- that will push China out of the region. The ultimate goal here, though, is a normalization agreement with Israel. We were getting close to that, until Iran decided, through its proxy in you know in Gaza and Hamas, to invade on October 7. So, the point is, we need to be talking about all this as a package. But again, we cannot have normalization until you have a cease-fire in Gaza. And I think that’s the more difficult piece here.
ED O’KEEFE: There’s so many conflicts in the world, I of course meant Israel. You acknowledge that in your answer, the idea of normalization between Saudi Arabia and Israel. A lot of issues around the world. There is one issue, though, back here at home, I want to talk to you about again, because you’re a member of the House Homeland Security Committee. Over the weekend, we saw Immigration and Customs Enforcement arrest the mayor of Newark, New Jersey outside a federal detention center, and they’re now threatening to arrest three Democratic members of Congress for allegedly assaulting or touching an ICE agent there on the scene. I’m just curious, should ICE be arresting or even threatening to arrest members of Congress?
REP. MCCAUL: I mean, that’s obviously a very drastic move. I would only do that if they were complicit with a crime. I don’t know all the facts behind this. If they were just visiting a detention center. That’s- I’ve done that many times. If they’re disrupting law enforcement, that’s another question. So, you know, we can peacefully protest in this country, but you cannot be complicit with gang violence against our law enforcement. And I think perhaps that’s what it comes down to. Ed, if I could just add one last thing on the Gaza, Governor David Beasley, who won the Nobel Peace Prize has been recently tasked into an effort, if you will. And I just talked to him on the phone, had many conversations with the Arab nations to try to get this aid into Gaza. He was a former World Food Programme president. If anybody can get this thing done, it’s him. And so I hold great hope that he may be able to bring an end to this conflict in Gaza, then we can get to normalization, that for the first time in our lifetime, we could see true peace in the Middle East.
ED O’KEEFE: There were reports that Beasley was going to be in charge of some kind of new effort. Are you telling us that he’s officially told you that’s the plan, now that he’s been hired to do it?
REP. MCCAUL: Well, it’s not official yet. I anticipate it will be. And he’s had the conversations with the Arab nations who very much trust him based on his prior performance.
ED O’KEEFE: Sure, absolutely and well known for his work with the World Food Programme. I do want to ask you one other thing, though, in the homeland security realm, because this past week, as well, White House senior advisor Stephen Miller said habeas corpus can be suspended at the time of an invasion, saying the administration is looking at ways to potentially do away with due process for undocumented immigrants. You’re an attorney, you’re someone who deals with Homeland Security issues and immigration being there from the Lone Star State. Is suspending habeas corpus for undocumented immigrants a good idea?
REP. MCCAUL: Well, this is- was done by President Abraham Lincoln during the Civil War. It’s a very extreme measure, you know, to take. Any person in the United States under the Constitution has due process rights. So, I think the courts are going to decide this one, as to whether this invasion, in fact, constitutes what would be a state of war. Some would say it would. People in my state of Texas see an invasion and the drug cartels and the danger that they bring into my state in this country. I think that will be a very interesting legal argument before the court.
ED O’KEEFE: Well, curious to call in an invasion, especially when the administration likes to remind us that border crossings are, of course, at a historic low. So that’ll be part of the legal debate. I suppose, Congressman–
REP. MCCAUL: — They have gone down substantial, yes.
ED O’KEEFE: They sure have. Congressman Michael McCaul, thank you for globetrotting with us this morning. We appreciate it, and we’ll be right back.
